Your game still has A LOT to learn from Diablo games

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ThreeBelowZero#2968 เขียน:

PoE1 is casual friendly. You can legit make almost anything blast through the game once you learn the mechanics. The tedious part is learning the mechanics.

hehe....

"the tedious part is learning the mechanics"

I don't disagree that ONCE YOU LEARN THE MECHANICS you can make almost anything work. But your statement is absolutely hilarious and myopic.


I don't know how much you've actually played PoE 1 to speak that way, I try not to judge people on their accounts especially since I post in a separate non-playing account....but the mechanics are precisely WHY PoE 1 is practically the poster child for the most un-friendly casual experience in the gaming world. Coupled with the required grind times on the upper middle to upper end...

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ThreeBelowZero#2968 เขียน:

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cowmoo275#3095 เขียน:

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ThreeBelowZero#2968 เขียน:

Then, we've got the facts: the game is not in a good spot to invite new players and have a good player retention. You might think current numbers are enough, but this is a business and should be runing smooth for at least a decade, so it has to do better for the masses while having content for the ones that play it dialy for 15 hours straight.

Those are not facts. Those are just more opinions based on almost nothing concrete. Don't confuse the two.

Oh sure, man. GGG doesn't want your money. Neither Tencent. They just wanna see us having fun.

Read around the forums. -/s People are having so much fun dying, losing XP, they are simply adoring the rng for crafting despite it being better this patch, and players also think drops are very good, everything dropping is just very useful for character progress. The feedback forum is full of positive notes /s-

Are you sure I am confused? Because it seems that it is you comparing a Ferrari which is a car thousands of dollars worth for adult drivers with a 30 dollars early access videogame that is being played by ''children''.

I am pointing as fact that they are giving what we have been asking for. I just want them to go faster.
Again: read the forums and check the patch notes. They are making the game for the masses, they just have to hurry.

this post is perfect.
and still people are defending against it ...

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ThreeBelowZero#2968 เขียน:

Oh sure, man. GGG doesn't want your money. Neither Tencent. They just wanna see us having fun.

Read around the forums. -/s People are having so much fun dying, losing XP, they are simply adoring the rng for crafting despite it being better this patch, and players also think drops are very good, everything dropping is just very useful for character progress. The feedback forum is full of positive notes /s-

Are you sure I am confused? Because it seems that it is you comparing a Ferrari which is a car thousands of dollars worth for adult drivers with a 30 dollars early access videogame that is being played by ''children''.

I am pointing as fact that they are giving what we have been asking for. I just want them to go faster.
Again: read the forums and check the patch notes. They are making the game for the masses, they just have to hurry.

Ahhh....instantly to the strawman. Gotta Love it.

1) Did I say GGG doesn't exist to make money? Ever? I merely said their business model is their own...and NOT some arbitrary business you deem it HAS to be, with no knowledge on their finances, goals, or business sense.
2) The forum is a collection of complaints and OPINIONS....not facts. Moreover, it represents a tiny tiny fraction of the playerbase's feelings. It is totally unreliable for "factual data". The people most likely to post are those with complaints, and so all you see are complaints. Forums are ALWAYS skewed in that way. Meanwhile the vast majority never post or even read anything here.
3) Yes....you are the one confused.
4) The ferrari comparison was one example in reference to your "factual statement" that GGG's business model is REQUIRED to cater to the masses.

Yes, again.....you are the one who is confused. Confused on what is fact vs. opinion, and confused on what is happening in this thread.

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cowmoo275#3095 เขียน:

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ThreeBelowZero#2968 เขียน:

Oh sure, man. GGG doesn't want your money. Neither Tencent. They just wanna see us having fun.

Read around the forums. -/s People are having so much fun dying, losing XP, they are simply adoring the rng for crafting despite it being better this patch, and players also think drops are very good, everything dropping is just very useful for character progress. The feedback forum is full of positive notes /s-

Are you sure I am confused? Because it seems that it is you comparing a Ferrari which is a car thousands of dollars worth for adult drivers with a 30 dollars early access videogame that is being played by ''children''.

I am pointing as fact that they are giving what we have been asking for. I just want them to go faster.
Again: read the forums and check the patch notes. They are making the game for the masses, they just have to hurry.

Ahhh....instantly to the strawman. Gotta Love it.

1) Did I say GGG doesn't exist to make money? Ever?
2) The forum is a collection of complaints and OPINIONS....not facts. Moreover, it represents a tiny tiny fraction of the playerbase's feelings. It is totally unreliable for "factual data".
3) Yes....you are the one confused.
4) The ferrari comparison was one example in reference to your "factual statement" that GGG's business model is REQUIRED to cater to the masses.

Yes, again.....you are the one who is confused. Confused on what is fact vs. opinion, and confused on what is happening in this thread.

1) Sure, mate. Less players equals more money. I am just bad at maths.
2) Sure, mate. They don't read forums because it is just a collection of complaints and OPINIONS....not facts. Moreover, it represents a tiny tiny fraction of the playerbase's feelings. It is totally unreliable for "factual data".. I think they just guessed what players didn't like and changed it. I mean, they would never create the forums to have feedback from their players. They take that feedback from Reddit because Reddit posts are 100% legit from players and they can also gather actual data from there. In their own forums?! I was mad crazy. My bad /s
3 and 4) Sure, mate. /s

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Oinkaments#6390 เขียน:

it doesn’t change the fact that for the overwhelming majority of PoE1 and PoE2 players, D3 and D4 are the embodiment of mediocrity.

It is so very interesting, that you talked to the overwhelming majority of PoE1 and PoE2 players to come to that conclusion. I am sure you can back those statements up with numbers and evidence. Besides the fact, that PoE1 has no relevance in any discussion to PoE2, besides being the same franchise.

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Oinkaments#6390 เขียน:

And honestly, D3 goes beyond just being bad, it's straight up treason. It’s the kind of game that makes you wonder if it was intentionally designed to crush the spirit of anyone who actually loved ARPGs.

So by that definition, a game who had 1 and only 1 player who loved the game, the sequel to that game, is worse, even if 7 million other people love the game, but that 1 player hates it.
You are telling me "Diablo 3 is bad", I'd argue the 6th best selling game in history is anything but bad. Objectively speaking.

By that definition PoE2 is good or bad based on the reception of PoE 1 players, and them only.

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Oinkaments#6390 เขียน:

There’s a reason people lose it when someone shows up on the PoE 2 forums singing praises of D3. On this forum, it represents everything we don’t want our genre to become.

Again, there are many for whom that might be true. But even then, there are many for whom it is not.

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Oinkaments#6390 เขียน:

That’s exactly the kind of statement I mean. "I consider it the best, and your dislike doesn’t make it bad". On the surface it sounds reasonable, but it’s stealth rage-bait. It’s phrased to look conciliatory while practically daring people to explode, a neat little provocation dressed up as opinion. Posts like that aren’t conversation-starters, they’re thread derailers.

Well, this is not a conversation-starter. If you missed it, we are in the middle of a conversation. And it is not a rage-bait. It is my opinion in this case. A valid opinion. As is any opinion.
If I wanted to bait people, there are probably easier ways to do so. But I might be wrong, I never tried it. Since I have better things to do with my time. If you want to take it as a rage-bait. Go ahead. Saying the sky is green doesn't make it real, neither does this.





If you did not like D3 and do not like D4 that is fine. And you can want PoE2 to be exactly as D2 and not use anything of D3 or D4. That does not change the fact that there are people who want some or many aspects of any of those games in PoE2. Same with Last Epoch. Same with any other game anyone likes. And especially now, where PoE2 is in early access and is targeted towards a wider audience (which it achieved already in comparison to PoE1), there are going to be people who like both, or like D3 or D4.
Like it or not, the forum is for everyone to share their thoughts. Not only to a bubble of maybe 10.000 people (arbitrary number) who think D2 is the pinnacle of ARPGs.

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cowmoo275#3095 เขียน:

No....it really isn't. Neither of those statements are true. Rationale is almost always given....and almost always ignored in favor of statements like yours that reduce it to a "sledgehammer", instead of any attempt at understanding.

Well if you just look at the comments on the first page, it is full with statements like "no thank you D3/D4 is bad, so don't take anything from it"
So there goes your argument.

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MRXass#2413 เขียน:

Like it or not, the forum is for everyone to share their thoughts. Not only to a bubble of maybe 10.000 people (arbitrary number) who think D2 is the pinnacle of ARPGs.

Is Diablo 2 the pinnacle of the genre?
In many ways, yeah, it’s the cornerstone everything else still gets measured against. D2 captured a level of atmosphere, tension, and reward pacing that most modern ARPGs either watered down or outright forgot existed.

But pinnacle doesn’t mean untouchable. It means defining. It set the bar so high that even decades later, studios keep tripping over it while chasing accessibility metrics and dopamine charts.

PoE took that DNA and evolved it: depth, customization, the feeling that you’re building something strong from the ground up. Meanwhile, D3 and D4 looked at D2’s blueprint and decided to replace its bones with shiny plastic.

So yeah, Diablo 2 remains the benchmark, not because it’s flawless, but because it understood the soul of the genre before everyone started trying to monetize it.

Like it or not, D2 is, was, still is the pinnacle to this day. I'm glad GGG recognized that and evolved their game around it. There is no doubt unless someone is blind, that POE was a straight up clone of D2 that evolved around it.

If they wanted to destroy their franchise, they would listen to the 20 people (arbitrary number) that thinks D3 was a good game.

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MRXass#2413 เขียน:

Well if you just look at the comments on the first page, it is full with statements like "no thank you D3/D4 is bad, so don't take anything from it"
So there goes your argument.

Lol....thanks for proving my point.

Out of the 6 or so "D3/D4 bad" comments on the first page, four of them flesh out why.

"full of statements"....precisely, even at a SECOND read you stopped at ONLY the one-line "d4bad" comment and completely ignored all the rest of the context provided. And much of it even more fleshed out over the next few pages.

But all you read was "d4bad". The reason why some don't dive right into their laundry lists is because they likely already have on numerous other occasions. Yet, if you called them out (like others DID)....they are more than happy to respond with specifics. AKA....the majority of all the other posts.

Look guys. Stop arguing like 3 years old children. Diablo series was fun, and it is still fun to play, but sadly some kids will never can because the ultra censorship of ALL overall games, i bet some players that are now like 30+ years old played a 20+ year old game, but the rest, that are now like 20 / 25 years old, cmon ... u all know nothing about Diablo and argue by default. Yes, the "resurrected" version is still out there but it takes out a lot of fun, playing it on a 60hz CRT monitor was the bomb.

First i want to say, welcome to PoE2 game tester section. U all paid to test the game, right ? Me included. We just want a final product that is worth the time spent ... i'm gonna shoot it directly, the crossbow reload when moving and running is clanky as hell, gotta go. Noobs better learn to postilion themselves. And stop making this game a zoom zoom, sonic game platformer, where u run and kill mobs like mario, it's not fun, the game needs essence and core mechanics besides "movement speed +10%" on boots just to out maneuver the abyss mobs AT THE START OF THE GAME. There are some things that destroy the "fun of doing the campaign" and the movement speed thing on boots is just awful, why do i wear boots ? To not get dirt on my feet skin ? Cmon ... be real guys.

Second the "magic find" thing ... i was building this before it all exploded, GGG cmon, we aren't stupid. How can new players make new 60/65+ lvl characters with 30/35+ worn items ? And the mobs are still moving and surround u in like 1.5 seconds ... how many combos can u do in 1 second GGG ? I'v died 50 times from lvl 40 to lvl 60 to all "goatcha" traps, including the stupid one shot monkee, this needs to revaluate everything, AT LEAST MAKE PLAYERS LISTEN TO NPC that instruct how to doge/tactic BEFORE the monkee like u did in Sexkemas, at least give them some tips on HOW THE HELL we can beat the boss/mob/thing whatever. In D2 u could do magic find and really find things that will help u, but here, everyone is just doing magic find for "currency farming" and "crafting".

Third thing. IF I WANTED A CRAFTING GAME, I WAS BUYING A CRAFTING GAME FROM STEAM AND MAYBE FARM OR CUT TREES TO CRAFT THINGS. This is an ARPG and the hole campaign must be done without any heavily crafted items, the "crafting things" maybe for 60/65+ players who want to grind, i just want to have fun in campaign and can not do that because ur all like "take this crap, put it in a slot machine, wait for it, NOOO! well, try again, or go fkurself". This is not crafting, no way, this is like some casino stuff, ocean eleven gangs, ur all slot machine punks, i am not wasting my money on this bull... be real here GGG. I wanted an ARPG that do not relay on CRAFTING and FARMING, i just want to make a big monkee ... i mean a big barbarian with a mallet and smash some things and have fun, i am not donkey kong loving man, but hell, the NPC are having more fun then me, they are like, let's bug and glich this mf out of space, and bam, i hit ALT + F4 and im on a roll.

Really, GGG, fix ur stuff ... really. Have fun yall, me hoping u all be healthy and good luck.

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ThreeBelowZero#2968 เขียน:

...Your game still has A LOT to learn from Diablo games

Especially from masterpiece Diablo 3....